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> When seconds count...
Posted: Apr 7 2008, 05:21 PM
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Yeah, but no one would die from DUIs if there were no cars...
Cars dont even save lives. They make things more convenient. People are dying so they dont have to take a bus or train.
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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 05:25 PM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 02:19 PM)
Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused?

That would be hard to do. Who keeps track of crimes that are never committed? Nothing got reported when my dad confronted 4 guys breaking into our garage with his pistol in hand. They scrammed and never looked back!
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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

DO NOT DEMAND WHAT YOU CAN NOT TAKE BY FORCE!

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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 06:31 PM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

I'm sure the cops do a better job with a firearm. If they didnt have one, their lives would be in danger more often and they would have to have more cops on scene to take down the guys.

you ever watch the show cops...it takes 3 or 4 of them to restrain someone as it is, when the guy goes nuts. in the scenario where the guy has a knife (since we're living in fantasy land without guns) and the cop is now without a firearm to protect himself what is he to do? he cant threaten to shoot the guy, he cant fire a leg shot...he's got to wait for backup and try to wrestle the knife away w/o getting slashed.

or you could just pop him in the leg and be done with it...or at the least keep distance with it.


if there were no guns then there would have to be more cops to defuse a threat...which equals more tax dollars...which makes you and me more poor.

DO NOT DEMAND WHAT YOU CAN NOT TAKE BY FORCE!

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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 08:49 PM
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QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 12:01 PM)
If five teens with bats and machetes cant even kill a single person, its pretty apparent that they're not trying to kill anyone.

"One teacher was treated at a hospital after being hit on the head with a bat when he tried to stop the attackers"

ohmy.gif

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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 08:50 PM
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QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 05:21 PM)
Yeah, but no one would die from DUIs if there were no cars...
Cars dont even save lives. They make things more convenient. People are dying so they dont have to take a bus or train.

It's a poor analogy b/c cars have a purpose (getting people around) other than potentially killing/injuring people. Guns only purpose are to destroy whatever they're pointed at.

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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 10:06 PM
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QUOTE (JW32Hoops @ Apr 7 2008, 05:49 PM)
QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 12:01 PM)
If five teens with bats and machetes cant even kill a single person, its pretty apparent that they're not trying to kill anyone.

"One teacher was treated at a hospital after being hit on the head with a bat when he tried to stop the attackers"

ohmy.gif

Never said anyone didnt get hit, just not hard enough to cause any real injury.

Even if you cover your head and someone hits you with a bat with a genuine attempt to kill you, you're leaving with a concussion, broken hand, fingers, and wrist. The only injuries reported were "cuts from broken glass and other minor injuries". I doubt they would fail to leave out concussions and/or broken bones in the article.
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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 10:20 PM
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QUOTE (JW32Hoops @ Apr 7 2008, 05:50 PM)
QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 05:21 PM)
Yeah, but no one would die from DUIs if there were no cars...
Cars dont even save lives. They make things more convenient. People are dying so they dont have to take a bus or train.

It's a poor analogy b/c cars have a purpose (getting people around) other than potentially killing/injuring people. Guns only purpose are to destroy whatever they're pointed at.

I live in a shitty neighborhood JW. Its pretty heavily infested with meth. I literally witness stolen property drop offs and drug deals almost daily.

If I have some tweaked out dude who's been up for a week straight break in my house I NEED my gun to destroy what it is pointed at. Ive lived in an honest to god meth house before (thanks mom) and some of these people are down right scary.

We've all seen episodes of cops where it takes 4-5 cops to subdue some of these people AFTER being pepper sprayed. What the fuck am I supposed to do if I'm unfortunate enough to find one of these people in my living room at 1am?
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Posted: Apr 7 2008, 11:07 PM
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QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 10:20 PM)
QUOTE (JW32Hoops @ Apr 7 2008, 05:50 PM)
QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 05:21 PM)
Yeah, but no one would die from DUIs if there were no cars...
Cars dont even save lives. They make things more convenient. People are dying so they dont have to take a bus or train.

It's a poor analogy b/c cars have a purpose (getting people around) other than potentially killing/injuring people. Guns only purpose are to destroy whatever they're pointed at.

I live in a shitty neighborhood JW. Its pretty heavily infested with meth. I literally witness stolen property drop offs and drug deals almost daily.

If I have some tweaked out dude who's been up for a week straight break in my house I NEED my gun to destroy what it is pointed at. Ive lived in an honest to god meth house before (thanks mom) and some of these people are down right scary.

We've all seen episodes of cops where it takes 4-5 cops to subdue some of these people AFTER being pepper sprayed. What the fuck am I supposed to do if I'm unfortunate enough to find one of these people in my living room at 1am?

At the end of the day, it's your right and it sounds like you live in Detroit or Beirut or somethin. It aint easy, for sure, but get your family outta there.

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 12:59 AM
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QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 05:25 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 02:19 PM)
Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused?

That would be hard to do. Who keeps track of crimes that are never committed? Nothing got reported when my dad confronted 4 guys breaking into our garage with his pistol in hand. They scrammed and never looked back!

Nice easy out there. Seriously, find me stats on the number of times guns, saved a life, vs how many lives they took.

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 01:00 AM
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QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

I never said cops shouldn't have guns, but normal people shoudln't

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 08:08 AM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:09 PM)
All gun related deaths are preventable, and very simply, GET RID OF THE GUNS.

is this not your quote?...note the words in all caps.

DO NOT DEMAND WHAT YOU CAN NOT TAKE BY FORCE!

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 11:43 AM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 09:59 PM)
QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 7 2008, 05:25 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 02:19 PM)
Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused?

That would be hard to do. Who keeps track of crimes that are never committed? Nothing got reported when my dad confronted 4 guys breaking into our garage with his pistol in hand. They scrammed and never looked back!

Nice easy out there. Seriously, find me stats on the number of times guns, saved a life, vs how many lives they took.

I never said that nor did I ever defend the comment. You are the one who brought it up. I'm not sure if it is true or false.
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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 11:57 AM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 10:00 PM)
QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

I never said cops shouldn't have guns, but normal people shoudln't

Wow. Lets depend on a cop entirely to save us from anyone not hopped up on drugs and not wielding more than a pocket knife. blink.gif

Police have no constitutional duty/responsibility to protect individuals
They're at least 3-5 minutes away.
They're much more worried about their safety and well being than they are about a complete strangers.
Very few are good shots, especially in combat.
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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 06:04 PM
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QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 8 2008, 08:08 AM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:09 PM)
All gun related deaths are preventable, and very simply, GET RID OF THE GUNS.

is this not your quote?...note the words in all caps.

Yes it is, whats your point?

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 06:06 PM
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QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 8 2008, 11:57 AM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 10:00 PM)
QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

I never said cops shouldn't have guns, but normal people shoudln't

Wow. Lets depend on a cop entirely to save us from anyone not hopped up on drugs and not wielding more than a pocket knife. blink.gif

Police have no constitutional duty/responsibility to protect individuals
They're at least 3-5 minutes away.
They're much more worried about their safety and well being than they are about a complete strangers.
Very few are good shots, especially in combat.

Um yes, there job is to protect citzens. it even says on there cars "To Protect and Serve"

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 06:19 PM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 8 2008, 03:06 PM)
QUOTE (Brad Cowin @ Apr 8 2008, 11:57 AM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 10:00 PM)
QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

I never said cops shouldn't have guns, but normal people shoudln't

Wow. Lets depend on a cop entirely to save us from anyone not hopped up on drugs and not wielding more than a pocket knife. blink.gif

Police have no constitutional duty/responsibility to protect individuals
They're at least 3-5 minutes away.
They're much more worried about their safety and well being than they are about a complete strangers.
Very few are good shots, especially in combat.

Um yes, there job is to protect citzens. it even says on there cars "To Protect and Serve"

Wrong buddy.

The supreme court of the United States of America ruled that police have no duty to protect individuals, but only society as a whole. Look it up and educate yourself.
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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 06:28 PM
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QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 8 2008, 01:00 AM)
QUOTE (Tswole @ Apr 7 2008, 06:23 PM)
QUOTE (azfittrainer @ Apr 7 2008, 05:19 PM)
Thats a bad analogy and you know it. Surgery saves hundreds of thousands more lives than it kills each year. Same with cars. Can you show me stats that show more crimes/deaths are prevented by firearms each year, than are caused? Driving drunk is illegal btw, and killing someone while drunk is murder.

i'm sure the cops prevent more crime when they have a pistol in hand. if the cops didnt have guns and neither did the criminal the cops might be in trouble unless they had numbers on their side, more officers on the scene.

I mean come on....pepperspray probably wont do but so much to a deraged crackhead when he's got the idea attacking. plus most cops are weak and flabby.

I never said cops shouldn't have guns, but normal people shoudln't

you said "GET RID OF ALL GUNS" and you also said "I NEVER SAID COPS SHOULDNT HAVE GUNS"

you're contridicting yourself.....read this page and you will see.....caught in your own web.

when you say GET RID OF ALL GUNS...all means all, right? so cops have guns too....so get rid of cops guns to get rid of all guns....think about it..but dont hurt yourself

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Posted: Apr 8 2008, 07:52 PM
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I never contradicted myself, you are just trying to make it seem that way. I said get rid of all guns, like they did in the UK, which means private citizens.

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