A Tad Biased? Is DMAE *really* that bad?

1Fast400 Forums > Supplements


Posted by: salmonax Jul 16 2007, 07:05 PM
After reading the article on DMAE I was frightened enough by the dangers of it (all new to me) to sift around a bit for more info. It was then I realized that DMAE really *is* touted as some kind of wonder-substance just about everywhere else, so that if Dave decided to write a bunch of hyperbole about the thing in order to make it obvious that there are problems with it and fails to live up to the claims, more power to him. But I don't felt it answered nearly as much as it should have. In fact the article was so slanted in that direction that I left with more questions than answers.

The first and biggest problem with the article is that it seems to ignore that DMAE clearly does *something* in the brain enough not to bother trying to explain what it does do. It mentions in passing, and only in passing, that the mechanisms for its effectiveness in hyperactivity are unknown.

DMAE raises choline levels both in the CNS and peripheral tissue and slows choline break-down. That's a start, but what does it MEAN? I mean, what are the implications and what effects does this actually produce? ONE article on PubMed suggests that choline and DMAE can stimulate cholinergic receptors directly, albeit very faintly.

So am I expected to believe that raising choline alone is enough to account for the effects and just leave it at that? The research suggests a complicated mess of things, so how about some real information about those addition to all the stuff about how it doesn't?

As for the real dangers I've seen (I don't know where things like 'retardation' come from, as in the side effects in Dave's right-up, for instance)

1) Changes phospholipid composition over time.
2) Reduces Betaine production, which seems like it could reduce creatine production in people who aren't taking it as a supplement.
3) Slows choline uptake, whatever the hell that means. There was one study where rats administered DMAE were compared behaviorally to rats taking a known anticholinergic, and although the rat behavior didn't change much from baseline it did NOT exhibit the same sorts of effects as anticholinergic. This is probably the most confusing and unelaborated point.

One other thing. People have also talked about taking this with ALCAR, which provides the acetyl group in the synthesis of acetylcholine. Is that enough to make aCH from all the additional choline floating around in the CNS from DMAE administration? I've got to many missing pieces to say for sure, and without them I can't say I really know a damn thing about DMAE.

Posted by: banzinator Jan 22 2009, 01:27 PM
bump, these are all good questions... now we just need some answers

anybody?

Posted by: Christoph Jan 29 2009, 04:19 PM
I took a lot of DMAE years ago. I'm pretty chemically sensitive and very aware of my state of mind.

First thing, DMAE does not mix with caffeine. I don't know why, but thats been my experience and everyone else's. If you mix them, your thinking gets 'fuzzy' and you get confused until the coffee wears off.

DMAE is not naturally occurring in the body, it does not get broken down easily and has a very very long half life (day or so). When you first start taking it, it doesn't have much of an impact, but over time (after consistent usage) it becomes more potent. I started taking it in 100 mg caps 2x or 3x a day. After a while I started taking less and less (because the effects became stronger and stronger). At the end of 10 weeks, I was opening the cap and measuring my dosage in 'grains' (like grains of sand).


I did a lot of reading up on it a long while ago, and the best that I can determine is that the DMAE is substituted for choline and is incorporated as part of the choline receptors in your brain. Then the other free floating DMAE in your system comes in and signals/trips all the receptors, which fire. Obviously this is a very crude explanation, but it explains why the required dosage decreases, and why it leads to a cascade of uncontrollable thoughts. If you take it regularly for any length of time you will understand. Its like your eyes are glued open and you just think think think think think think. To sit still and do nothing is unbearable. I was once on a 6 hour airline flight just after I dosed, and I thought I was going to go insane 'cause there was nothing to do. Really, it was hell.

I don't know if it was all the running or the DMAE I did, but my muscles were rock hard most of the time. Its a strong nootropic, no doubt, but while using it I was unable to sleep without a combination of melatonin and both types of over the counter sleeping pills. Seriously, I took sleeping pills every night.

heres something interesting: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=21764