Cycling your Supplements |
1Fast400 Forums > Supplements |
| Posted by: DR X Mar 23 2006, 11:38 PM |
| If you have taken creatine, ephedra, or any other supplement non-stop for the past year or so, raise your hand? If you're a serious lifter and you're not raising your hand, then you shame on you. Most serious lifters believe that when they are "off" of supplements that their physiques will literally go down the drain. I firmly believe this because I have encountered many serious lifters who believed that supplements could make or break their physiques. At one point in time, I was one of these believers. However, I have realized the error of my ways and turned to cycling my supplements. Before I give you examples of supplement cycling, I would like to address a very important biological point. Without getting scientific, the human body is a fascinating piece of biological machinery. It is smart. Smarter than we choose to believe. When our bodies are exposed to exogenous substances such as supplements, alcohol, drugs, etc, it builds a tolerance. This tolerance requires us to consume more and more of the product in order to get the desired effect. This characteristic stems from receptor attenuation. You see, our body is full of receptors which have the ability to bind to specific receptor agonists and antagonists. Receptor agonists activate the receptors while antagonists do the exact opposite. So the more receptors you flood over the time, the more they become desensitized. This can lead to receptor burnout which can cause a myriad problems. So basically, abuse of a substance is a no-no. -Cycling Creatine- Creatine is one of the most popular sports supplements in the industry today. Why? Because it works. I've read countless articles which suggests creatine's effectiveness and not one which suggests that creatine is detrimental to the human body. However, all of the articles I have read involve the use of 20 grams of creatine utilizing a one month on, X amount of time off system. So the subjects all took 20 grams of creatine in divided doses throughout the day for an entire month and then took some time off. The time varied from study to study but for the sake of receptor attenuation, I would take at least 2 weeks off. If you've ever tried creatine, then you will know how quickly you can make gains when you first introduce it to your system. However, these gains began to diminish over time because your body simply got accustomed to the creatine. Now if you would "cycle" creatine, so to speak, then theoretically, you could make gains similar to the ones you made when you initially began creatine intake. There are numerous ways to cycle creatine and I will suggest a few ways which were successful for me in the past. 20 grams for one month straight divided into four 5 gram doses while taking 2 weeks off in between cycles. 10 grams after working out every day for 6 weeks and then taking 2 weeks off. 5 grams after working out every day for 8 weeks and then taking 2 weeks off. Now you may cycle your creatine differently and if this different method works for you, then stick with it until it stops working. Remember that I am merely sharing with you some of my successful cycles with creatine. -Cycling Thermogenics- Now here is a supplement which I have abused for the past two years and I'm not even sure why. At first, it was for its proposed fat burning properties but later, it became apparent I was using it just to feel normal, whatever that was. The first time I took a thermogenic, I remember feeling this alertness which I have never felt before. What an amazing supplement, or so I thought at the time. If you don't know, thermogenics drain the adrenal glands. The more you use it, the more burned out your adrenals become. It's as simple as that. Now if you're wondering if your adrenals are burned out, there is an easy way to find out. If you get headaches and feel extremely lethargic when you're not taking thermogenics, then your adrenals are burned out. What you have to do now is to assist your adrenals in recovery by eliminating all stimulants from your supplement stack. This includes ephedra, caffeine, etc. Now you should take a lot of Vitamin B5 and siberian ginseng. The first few days are always the hardest because you will feel the urge to take thermogenics but you must resist. Do this for a few weeks to repair your adrenals so that the next time you get on thermogenics, you can maximize your gains. In order to keep your receptors from desensitizing, you need to cycle thermogenics. I have been very bad with cycling thermogenics since I've incorporated them into my supplement stack but I will tell you that it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the best way to take stimulants is to do sporadically. Here is an effective way to take any thermogenic and to keep your adrenals from burning out. 1. 2-4 thermogenic tabs on training days for 4-6 weeks and then take 2 weeks off from all stimulants. -Supplements Which Do Not Need Cycling- Protein, fortunately for bodybuilders, is one of those things which doesn't need to be cycled. You can consume protein to your liking but experts suggest anywhere from 1-2 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight in order to maximize muscle gains. I try to consume about 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight because the latter is difficult to do if you want to have something of a life outside of training and eating. Glutamine, the most abundant free form amino acid in the body, is another supplement which doesn't need cycling. Glutamine, whether you choose to believe it or not, is extremely important. If you don't believe me, then read some literature on glutamine because I don't want to sit here and walk you through its many uses. Multivitamins and antioxidants also fall into this category. If you aren't taking one, you should and you should do it all of the time. Most of us can't get enough of the vitamins and minerals just from the foods we eat and a supplement is the best way to overcome this. There are a few other supplements which I believe do not need to be cycled but these three are the most important. Taking these three year round can only benefit you. -Cycling Supplements- All supplements, just like creatine and thermogenics, should be cycled because of receptor attenuation. If you aren't cycling your supplements, then maybe it's time you thought about what you're doing to your body. Remember, it's better to train and supplement smart than to do it blindly. Train hard, train smart, think BIG! |
| Posted by: thriceday Mar 24 2006, 12:34 AM |
| Do BCAA's such as Xtend need to cycled as well? |
| Posted by: Pxboarder Mar 24 2006, 12:45 AM |
| BCAA are the broken down protiens...so the answere is no |
| Posted by: FlawedPorcelain Mar 24 2006, 03:05 AM |
| Ok I think im getting the creatine idea... when you say 20g, do you mean 20 grams a day? Because im being told to do a teaspoon of CEE before and after workout... thats only like 3200mg... your help is appreciated... GREAT THREAD! |
| Posted by: Slayer of Souls Mar 24 2006, 03:08 AM | ||
That article is referring to Creatine Monohydrate. CEE theoretically has superior oral bioavailability and hence dosages of 3-5 grams will suffice. |
| Posted by: glsa17 Mar 24 2006, 10:05 AM |
| excellent post Dr. X as usual. |
| Posted by: Justin18951 Mar 24 2006, 10:21 AM |
| Good post. I have been cycling creatine ever since I used it but thermo's man I stink been on them for years straight. I need to cycles thes better, I will start after the summer. You are right...the thermo's are hard I just use them to keep normal now. |
| Posted by: hetrick30ex Mar 24 2006, 12:08 PM |
| Great post. I think every kid @ my gym needs to read this. Thanks X |
| Posted by: Succio Mar 24 2006, 02:28 PM | ||
dont worry about it, you dont need to cycle CEE. |
| Posted by: Fishdog Mar 24 2006, 03:19 PM |
| X thanks for the great post I always cycle everything except protein and vitamins. |
| Posted by: DR X Mar 24 2006, 03:31 PM | ||||
Yes you do. That was one of the points of the thread. As for CEE 1teaspoon before and after workout is sufficient. |
| Posted by: 325press Mar 24 2006, 03:38 PM |
| Good post! makes perfect sense..alot of people will learn from this. |
| Posted by: hrdgain81 Mar 24 2006, 03:38 PM |
| And for those who dont know, over use of thermo's and subsiquent adrenal blowout can lead to other ailments such as depleated immune system function, cronic fatique, and depression. Great post as usual X. |
| Posted by: Succio Mar 24 2006, 04:31 PM | ||||||
F* LOL i meant to say loading phase. |
| Posted by: rockhopper Mar 24 2006, 04:53 PM |
| well said Dr. X |
| Posted by: DR X Mar 26 2006, 06:02 PM |
| bump |
| Posted by: Slayer of Souls Mar 27 2006, 10:09 AM | ||
Lets just pin it for a while. |
| Posted by: brunner_wrestler May 18 2006, 11:34 AM |
| i have a question about stacking. Right now i am using Halodrol-50 and Methyl Masterdrol. should i take both of these at the same time or seperate them? |
| Posted by: the_menace Aug 11 2006, 01:33 PM | ||
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| Posted by: magoo202 Aug 11 2006, 01:36 PM |
| Just take 5g post workout. You shouldnt need 10. Once your cells are saturated, no more is going to be beneficial, so you just need to maintain with 5g. |
| Posted by: gabe522k3 Aug 17 2006, 07:29 PM |
| Would you need to cycle Fish Oil pills? |
| Posted by: Purepower Aug 17 2006, 07:47 PM | ||
nope. |
| Posted by: TittyDance Sep 21 2006, 08:37 AM |
| So after time your body basically becomes immune to Creatine and you dont get any more gains? How long does that take? |
| Posted by: seanmack13 Oct 9 2006, 10:50 AM |
| Just want to clarify: loading CEE is NOT necessary, correct? Just received 100gms of it and I haven't really read much info on it, but it would make sense that loading is uneccesary d/t quick bioabsorption rate. |
| Posted by: kingdong Nov 26 2006, 11:40 AM |
| What's up fellow gym rats ?just bought xmass ,tren,peramax.What's the best way stack ? |
| Posted by: alecto42c Nov 28 2006, 05:46 PM |
| Xtend does not need to be cycled, it is simply amino acids. |
| Posted by: derek99512 Jan 10 2007, 06:17 AM | ||
agreed but its a little to expensive for me to put make it a staple supplement |
| Posted by: Eric137638 Jan 15 2007, 03:52 PM |
| Good thread!! I learned something. |
| Posted by: Houston139203 Jan 30 2007, 05:54 PM |
| good advice dr x |
| Posted by: Houston139203 Jan 30 2007, 06:02 PM |
| i need some advice, i was think of takin green bulge, white blood, and a pre workout supp. i was also thinkin bout takin some kre-alkalyn |
| Posted by: calotono Feb 13 2007, 09:29 PM |
| in MRI´s webpage they say that you dont need to cycle off CE2. is that true? |
| Posted by: Talisman Apr 7 2007, 07:23 PM | ||
probably not...they just want you to take their stuff forever...  ive never heard of ANYTHING thats a supp with significant effects (other than like luecine and stuff) that u dont cycle...even arginine needs to be cycled. and on mri's page they say it takes 40 days to see small results...phoeey on cee i gained an inch on my arms in 28 friggin days |
| Posted by: reammecln May 24 2007, 01:32 AM | ||
"In one study, a maintenance dose (3 g/day) took thirty days to maximize creatine stores. On the other hand, a loading dose (20 g/day) maximized muscle creatine levels in only two days. Normal maintenance doses fall in the 3-5 g range (2 g has been found to be insufficient), although some take as much as 10 g, while 20-30 g (usually 20 g) is used for loading. Some sources recommend a loading phase of 6-7 days, but this appears to be unnecessary. Given that stores are maximized after two days of loading, 2-3 days should be sufficient. One study indicated that resistance training athletes can utilize around 50 mg/kg daily of creatine. A maintenance dose of 5-10 g daily is recommended to ensure that enough is being taken. Taking more than this for maintenance is generally a waste of creatine." http://forums.beyondmuscle.com/?showtopic=4959 ok so i've never taken creatine, but im willing to give it a go so would it be good if i did something like this: Loading Phase for 3 days: 20g/day [half preworkout, half postworkout] Maintenance Phase for rest of month: 5g/day 2 weeks off 6 weeks of 10g/day [half preworkout, half postworkout] 2 weeks off 8 weeks of 5g/day [half pre w, half post w] ...etc |
| Posted by: fluke May 24 2007, 01:52 PM | ||
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| Posted by: reammecln May 27 2007, 11:12 AM | ||||
seriously tho, is that good? i wanna start today or tomorrow -thx |
| Posted by: Guess_what May 29 2007, 04:54 AM |
Hello all.... im a new member here, ad i need ur help guys, im 30 years old, my weight is 154 lb ( 70 kg ) and im tall 76.5" (195 cm), so im so skinny  , i wanna go to the gym by the first of june , and i wanna buy the following suplements to start with :- Nitric boost ( optimum ). - Serious mass 6 lb ( optimum). - 100% Whey Protein - Gold Standard( optimum ). - Creatine 2500, 200 Capsules ( optimum ) which better caps or powder. So is it a good cycle from me as a beginner, or do i have to wait for a while and then start this cycle or any suggested cycle. thanks |
| Posted by: Blauman074 Aug 13 2007, 12:09 AM |
| creatine cycle helped me. thanks |
| Posted by: Big_Ben Aug 30 2007, 11:58 AM | ||||
What a minute....I'm still confused about the first sentence in this article... So if I haven't used Creatine non stop for a year and cycled it like a good little boy, shame on me?!!!!!!! I've re-read that, and still don't get it. So you say you should be taking it year round then you say you should cycle it....WTF?!!! |
| Posted by: dwisell77 Aug 30 2007, 02:05 PM | ||
LOL, no he's saying bull Sh** ur a liar bc we serious lifters have all remained on supps for more than a year straight without cycling. |
| Posted by: ibtigg Nov 5 2007, 10:34 AM |
| I am trying to gain weight and mass but I have never been able to do so. I am 5'9" 145lb.s. Could you give a suggestion on which supplements to start with and what else would be a good idea. |
| Posted by: Jayv24 Nov 12 2007, 08:02 PM | ||
*slowly raises hand* I know my adrenals are burnt. You're saying cycle off for a few weeks so you can maximize gains...but by the time i get back on my ephedrine, i'll look like homer simpson or some shit...so id prob shed the fat at warp speed once i started taking it again, but until then it would be a crappy situation. i know i need to cycle and there is no easy way out. Cardio, diet and heavy weight lifting are the key to keeping your metab in gear. Id have to literally chain myself to a radiator for 3 weeks to stay away from ephedrine. I cant even function without it. Forget about cycling caffeine, holy shit. id probably hang myself from my Lat tower in 2 days. Good advice, but easier said than done i suppose. P.S. i wonder if using panax ginseng and other Adrenal gland protectants on-cycle with stims would keep those glands in shape during use. You're right though, cycling off is the only way to recover. |
| Posted by: vanquish Nov 12 2007, 08:14 PM |
| Dude, Jayv, you're huge. Good job. |
| Posted by: mmakshak Dec 11 2007, 11:06 AM |
| Edgar Cayce thinks vitamins should be cycled. |
| Posted by: josh215295 Dec 11 2007, 01:01 PM |
| HI there, Best topic i could find to post this on, new member and cant make a topic. But i am 22 6'1 and 155ish. little on the skinny side. I just started taking SIZEON by Gaspari and am about 3 days into it, lovin it so far. BUT im taking that and protein shakes atm. Looking to bulk up quite a bit, but also be able to keep the gains, any suggestions. MAybe NO2 stuff, not really knowledgable on supplements etc. I took a few "steroid" type things when i was younger loved the results but they never stayed so im goin for a more steady approach now. Any type of thing i should take in specific. Just trying to bulk up and keep it up. THanks guyss |
| Posted by: DR X Dec 11 2007, 03:56 PM | ||
Post your diet in the diet section. |
| Posted by: majkisti Feb 4 2008, 01:22 PM |
| Very useful info |
| Posted by: Dwenzel34 Feb 4 2008, 04:13 PM |
| Solid Thread X |
| Posted by: aja525 Mar 3 2008, 10:00 PM |
| Newbie Question... doing some research, need some advice Graphic designer with a graphic designer physique. Pear shaped. I'm 32 have started lifting again (since high school), doing cardio, and eating right, but I do want to jumpstart the process a little quicker. Never done any supplements except for creatine in high school. Getting some blood work done and going to get my testosterone levels checked because I am thinking about starting testosterone pellets from a physician. Also thinking about these supplements in the meantime... Testadrol 50 Dymatize Xpand MAN Scorch Also need a good protein shake supplement. Any thoughts out there that could help me out. Much Appreciated. |
| Posted by: Brakloes Mar 11 2008, 06:02 PM |
| So I am new to this board....and have a question regarding products like AAKG, citriline malate and stuff. Do these types of things need cycling? For example you can arginine before and after workouts for an expended period of time does the body stop reacting to it? I have been out of the loops so I am not even sure abou tthe citriline stuff or glycergrow or its bulk counterpart GSM? |
| Posted by: MichiganHater Mar 26 2008, 03:03 PM |
| Go away bomber |
| Posted by: Christin06 Apr 25 2008, 07:55 AM |
| Supplements help the body towards optimal health. Many people see wonderful results and want to say that they were 'healed or cured'. This is wrong. Buying nutritional supplements isn’t about money; it’s about your commitment to yourself. You owe it to yourself and your family to maintain your health as best you can. Prevention is all-important; buying nutritional supplements is the ultimate in prevention! However, because we’re all susceptible to illness and disease despite our best efforts, it makes even more sense to buy good-quality nutritional supplements that make it easier for our bodies to fight off an invading illness. http://www.maxliferesearch.com/maryspromise |
| Posted by: ftank Apr 25 2008, 09:53 AM | ||
BAN-STICK!  |
| Posted by: Bulkster Bill Jun 2 2008, 02:55 PM |
Hey im kinda new to all of this, what would you recomend as the best supplement to all around bulk up  |
| Posted by: massman26 Jun 2 2008, 07:38 PM |
| Thanks for the helpful thread! Very insightful. |
| Posted by: nikoli Jul 15 2008, 09:32 PM |
| well that was some mighty useful info. Thanks for it! |
| Posted by: HighDefHealth Sep 1 2008, 07:32 PM |
| Banned for Spamming |
| Posted by: RandyOrton Sep 2 2008, 08:12 PM | ||||
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| Posted by: Josephin Sep 18 2008, 05:06 AM |
Ok ... Iam getting good idea about creatine so it means creatine need to be cycled or else tit may cause harm to our body and also its a good supplement.http://www.osteotrim.com/ingredients.htm |
