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> Cutting Supplements..., which to combine/not combine?
Posted: Feb 12 2004, 02:23 PM
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Hello, I am 29 yrs old, 6'1", 220 lbs, casual weight lifter for about 5 years -- off and on. I would like to lose body fat, and I have never done a "cutting cycle" before. I have trained for marathons and gotten skinny before, but this time I would like to keep muscle as much as possible (haven't heard that before have you?) My current supplementation is as follows:
* pre-workout (5 am) - 1 slice whole wheat bread, 1 scoop Whey in 12 oz nonfat milk, 2g Creatine
* post-workout (7-ish) - 1 banana, 2g Creatine, 1 scoop Whey in 12oz nonfat milk.
* breakfast - oatmeal, multivitamin
* bedtime - 3 caps ZMA
Supplements just purchased: Cytodyne Xenadrine EFX, ANSI Thermo Hydroxadrine, Tribulus, Vanadyl Sulfate, 5-HTP, Melatonin.
Q #1: When cutting, should I keep taking the whey and creatine pre and post workout along with the thermogenics supps?
Q #2: Which of following supps used for cutting, which for bulking - ZMA, Vanadyl Sulfate, Tribulus, 5-HTP? (I don't want the supps working cross-purposes or cancelling each other out.)

Thanks for your help.
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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 02:30 PM
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Is that all you're eating?!?

Health is not the absence of symptoms.
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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 02:38 PM
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"Is that all you're eating?!? "

Sorry -- I was just giving the supplements details.
I eat 4 more meals throughout the day, about every 3 hours -- tuna, chicken breast, apples, pears, oranges, green beans -- stuff like that.
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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 03:43 PM
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QUOTE (Big A @ Feb 12 2004, 02:23 PM)

Q #1:  When cutting, should I keep taking the whey and creatine pre and post workout along with the thermogenics supps?


I don't see any problems there.

QUOTE
Q #2:  Which of following supps used for cutting, which for bulking - ZMA, Vanadyl Sulfate, Tribulus, 5-HTP?  (I don't want the supps working cross-purposes or cancelling each other out.)


IMO The ZMA, Vanadyl and Tribulus are pretty worthless. The 5-htp may help with carb cravings and the melatonin would be a good alternative to ZMA if it's purpose was to help with sleep.

Health is not the absence of symptoms.
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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 04:15 PM
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Tribulus is crap as LTE pointed out, and vanadyl is really only of use when consuming large amounts of carbs or on carb ups, but some dont even respond to it then either. Plus chronic intake can build up to toxic levels.

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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 07:34 PM
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Actually, if fat loss is your #1 goal (and muscle maintenance doesn't matter to you), then ditch the creatine. Here's the schematic:

Creatine use -) 'mas' ATP = less AMPK activation during workout = a higher level of ACC activation in the post-workout hours = more malonyl-CoA will be floating around = you oxidatize less FFAs

However, if you're looking to strike a balance and maintain your LBM to a greater degree, then keep the creatine.

And I agree with everybody else on the Vanadyl. Not only does it suck, it's also toxic in high doses... blink.gif

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Posted: Feb 12 2004, 10:52 PM
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I am pretty much in agreement...

-Ditch the tribulus and vanadyl, and bring the ZMA down to one cap (or, continue to take it - it is doubtful that it will make a difference though)
-The creatine may hinder fat loss to an extent, however if you seek to retain muscle, I would continue to take it as it will really help out in that department

A2 Q#1: Most definitely keep taking the whey
A2 Q#2: The first two are worthless in any situation IMO, I don't know much about 5-HTP

Anyway, also be careful about combining those thermos, they contain many similar ingredients, I would take half the dose of each at first.

David Tolson
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